| "We Winna Be Dauntit". What is the correct Gaelic spelling of the Kilties' motto? During a discussion about the Kilties' motto back in 2003, the question was asked: "There's been many forms of the motto throughout the years. What's the correct form?" Since Kilties Drum Major Carl Last first uttered WE WINNA BE DUNTED (1962-ish), the motto has been spelled different ways. It was decided to write to Scottish experts to find out. Out of three requests, five replies were received, including one from someone who just completed the first official government document in Scots for the Scottish Parliament in 300 years. In summary, "DUNTED" [to be beaten with a stick or rock, to bump, or the noise such makes] is not the right word, and "DAUNTED" isn't either - it's English of course. "DAUNTIT" means "we will not be suppressed, subdued or overcome". Following is the most pertinent research correspondence on the motto: From: "Scots Language Resource Centre" Subject: Re: We Will Never Be Defeated - in Scottish Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:35:38 -0000 It is a pleasure to hear from Wisconsin. I have been told that pedants are prone to over-scotticise the spelling of words to prove that Scots is a language in its own right and not simply 'bad' English. This may be what has happened over the years. However, there seems to be no concensus about the spelling of Scots and this is causing great debate at present as Scot[s]are promoting the language as well as the culture. I think your motto would be more accurate if it were We Winna (or Winnae) be Dauntit. To dunt is to bump or the noise caused by being bumped or thudded. Dauntit is the past tense of daunton which is a verb to subdue, suppress, overcome. I think this is more in keeping with the ethos of your group. Winna or winnae are both ok. I cannot see any entry for wea or bea. I hope this has been of some help. Perhaps more important than the spelling is the oral use of Scots. Thank you for your interest, Aileen Hume ********************************** Sarah Gundry had written: Hi: I know that there is a guy who works for the Official Report at the Scottish Parliament. He recently translated the first official document to be produced in Scots in 300 years (2 weeks ago!) He's your man! Kind Regards, Sarah --- From Andrew Philip, Scottish Parliament: Your request for a definitive spelling of your motto has just been passed to me. Happy to assist. It's quite straightforward, although, as Scots doesn't yet have a standardised spelling system, there are a couple of possibilities, neither of which are quite the ones you gave. However, I recommend you spell the motto: WE WINNA BE DAUNTIT You can stop there if you like, but I'll give a quick review of the other options below in case you're interested. You could, instead of "winna", write "winnae" (but not "winnea"!). The choice is largely a matter of dialect, and as you've had "winna" in the past I'd stick with it. "Winna" is also the older form, which works nicely for a motto. According to the Concise Scots Dictionary, you can also spell "dauntit" as "dantit", but that's not a spelling I've seen in use. "Dunt" is a Scots noun and verb, but it basically means a heavy blow and has no overt associations with defeat that I know of or can see in the dictionary. Virtually yours, Andy Philip *************************************** "Seonaidh Caimbeul" wrote: Hallo, 'We winna be dunted' makes perfect sense. The other thing doesn't [this was WEA WINNEA BEA DAUNTED]. Could it be an attempt at an American pronunciation? If you want to be really correct about it, the form 'duntit' might be better. 'We winna be duntit'. 'Dunted' or 'duntit' means to be struck or 'beaten'. In English 'We shall not be beaten'. We don't really have 'shall' in Scots. That's why we say 'winna'. or 'Will na'. The 'na' part is the negative, corresponding to the English 'not'. But we join it onto the word, eg, haena 'have not', mauna 'must not' etc. But these forms, although once used for many verbs only are used now for haena, daena, mauna, winna, wadna, suldna, and maybe a few others I can't think of now. Aye, canna. A canna think e noo oan ony ithir anes. But dinna tak ma wurd fur't ! Ging tae http://www.scots-online.org/ an ye'll see fur yersel whit like e Scots is. Aw e Best onywey, Jock Campbell *************************************** "Seonaidh Caimbeul" wrote again: I wasn't joking about the American pronuciation. It happens quite often that people in America will put their own spelling onto Scots phrases. 'Dauntit' is Scots for 'daunted'. It's a different word from 'dunted'. Most people in Scotland speak an anglicised version of Scots, really only just English with a Scottish accent. However, there are still some people in some areas whose first language is Scots. Scots and English are both descended from the mutually intelligible languages of Germanic invaders who came from the low countries and settled on the eastern coasts of what are now Scotland and England from around 500 --800 ad. There are no major philosophical differences between Irish and Scots Gaelic. They are both descended from the Gaelic spoken in Ireland around 500-800 A.D. At around the same time as the Germanic tribes were settling the eastern coast of Scotland the Gaelic tribes were settling the west. The languages are not now easily mutually intelligible but until about two hundred years ago they formed a speech continuum running from the very south of Ireland to the very north of Scotland. Deliberate anti-Gaelic policies by various Scottish, English and British governments have attempted to drive us apart but we continue to try to communicate and to reform. If this is the last ceilidh then we will make it a good one. Good luck with all your adventures, toot that flute! Jock Campbell |